Design Matters

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Design is everywhere, but do we podcasters get it wrong? And when we do get it wrong,

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what is the real life impact on the success of our show? That is what I'm gonna

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talk about today here on the podcast Accelerate because it's a very, very important

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subject. And you might be fooled into believing that we're just gonna talk about

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graphic design. That is completely wrong. We are not, because design is so much more.

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This is of course the podcast accelerator. I'm your host, Mark Asquith. And I just want

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to thank, before we go any further, the wonderful Rich Graham, who recently sent

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me, he sent me a little bit of beer money to say thank you for the podcast. So

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Rich, I appreciate you, my friend. Thank you so much for doing that. And if you want

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to be like Rich, and if you want to say, Marco, listen, I appreciate the podcast,

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go and have a little meretti on me. You can do so at mark.live slash support. I

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also want to thank. A couple of my most recent guests, Mike Willa and the wonderful

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Dave Jackson. Two amazing previous episodes that we've just done very, very recently. And

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we've just had fantastic feedback. In fact, the last three episodes. I feel like

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people have got a heck of a lot from it was revenue lessons from big podcasts, which

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I think is, again, a very important subject for the independent podcaster. And

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we're sort of going to build on that today. We're going to build on that today because

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design is tied to that. And also. The lessons that we learned from Mike Waller and

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Dave Jackson in the previous two episodes have really been well received. So thank you

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to everyone for the kind words on those episodes. I like mixing it up a little bit

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with this podcast. I'm enjoying the fact that I'm doing interviews and doing some

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of my own content and so on. So if you're enjoying the format, let me know on Twitter

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at Mr. Asquith. And I say, if you want to be like rich and chukkas a little bit of

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beer money, you can do so at mark.live slash support. Design. is everywhere. Design

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is vital and you interact with design every single time you look at something, you

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touch something, you move something, you enjoy something, you don't enjoy something,

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you have a good experience, you have a bad experience. Everything in our lives in

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2023 and beyond is affected by design. Good design, bad design, indifferent design,

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design that you don't notice because it's either very good or very bad and very

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often you actually only do only notice. bad design and that's the sort of irony of

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designers that great design just like simplicity goes unnoticed because you expect

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good things we are well designed as human beings you know we don't we don't notice

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that we're so well designed but we are and that's fine you know we have expectations

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of what we are as beings we've got the two arms we've got the two legs we've got the

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head we walk in a certain way and you know we don't notice unless something is different

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okay and that's the point that I want to get to today is that design is everywhere.

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All right. And there's a few misconceptions I want to just bash. There's some, I guess,

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some thoughts that I want to give you about what you should be focusing on when it

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comes to design. Now, I'm not going to tell you how to build cover art. I'm not

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going to tell you how to design things. This is a mindset that I want to teach you

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and talk to you about because it's something that I've always had, I've always had a design

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oriented mindset, even though I didn't realize I had for a long, long time until I

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really got into business. And even now, I know I drive some of our graphic designers

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and our user interface designers crazy because I'm a bit of a stickler. I'm a bit

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of a stickler for good design. You know, I don't, bad design stands out. I'd rather

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you didn't notice that Captivate was well designed, but you never had any problems.

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You didn't have any friction. You just somehow it felt easy and you didn't quite know

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why. Like that's the ultimate. Okay. That's design. doing its job. So let's think

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about design for podcasting. Design for podcasting generally takes or is generally

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considered to just be graphic design. All right. And that's the first mistake that

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people make. So design is very often commoditized. Graphic design in particular,

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we've got amazing tools like Canva that you can knock up some cover art. Really nicely

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done cover art within Canva within a few minutes. You can do that. I did that only

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this week. for a new podcast that I'm putting together with some friends. And I did

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it. It's good. Is it professional enough? Yes. Does it tick the boxes and will it stand

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out in the directories? Yes. Did it cost much? No, it didn't. And this is, I think,

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the first mistake that people make when it comes to design and then, you know, the

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sub niche of graphic design. Just because Canva is free doesn't mean that design is cheap.

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OK, let me say that again. Just because things like Canva are free, doesn't mean that

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design is cheap. Because all of these templates that are within Canva that allow

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people that aren't designers, you know, you, me, and people that aren't designers,

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tools like that allow people to democratize design and to access good design and to just

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mildly customize it to look good, guess what? They are powered by a very expensive

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designers. So design is a skill, it's a talent, it's a craft, it's something that

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you own. and that you should value. It's not cheap, all right? A lot of people

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say, why does it cost so much to design a logo or design a website? Because you can't

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do it. And if you think you can, you're probably wrong, all right? The point is, right,

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I can move bricks around and I can mix mortar up and I can dig. And they're all the

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constituent pieces of building a house. Yeah, and I can buy timber. I can buy glass

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and glazing, I can buy window frames. But do you think the house that I build myself

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using my own hands that aren't skilled in that way is gonna be livable, is gonna be

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good enough? Of course it's not because everything's a skill and we cheapen design,

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we commoditize design and we shouldn't do, all right? So just because design is accessible

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using things like candle, which you should be using. I did mine on Cambly yesterday,

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the new cover art. My podcast accelerator. Cover art is done on Canva. Now granted, it's

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done using brand guidelines, which I'm not going to talk about today because it's

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very different. It's done using brand guidelines so that I almost can't get it wrong.

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And it's got good photography, so I almost can't get it wrong. But it's still physically

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done on Canva. But as I said, really want to hit this home. Design is not cheap

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and you shouldn't think about it as being cheap because the Canva design platform,

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to use that as an example again, is powered by world class designers designing

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those templates. Like they don't come from nowhere. They're not magic. All right.

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So that's the first thing I want you to understand. Design is not cheap, but we

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sadly commoditize it. You see all the time in the Facebook groups in podcasting,

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why does it cost this much to get a cover art? Well, you either have bad cover

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art, you either use a template and understand it's probably gonna be from a template and

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look templated, or you get someone to do it. And if you get someone to do it, they

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deserve pain. So don't be an asshole. when it comes to paying people or something

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like that. I would hate for someone to, why do I have to pay a subscription fee

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to get your premium content? You know, you would think, well, of course you bloody

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do, because this is what I do, look at all the work I put in. So don't be a dick

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when it comes to design, all right? Don't cheapen design just because you think

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it's easy or think it's cheap or well, it's easy. Look at that, that can't have taken

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long. It's only a few lines on the screen. Well, you go and do them then. And that's the

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point, you can't do it that well. So. Graphic design is what we normally think of

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as design when it comes to podcasting. But what I want you to really understand is

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that design touches everything. All right. I walked through a door. This is an

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analogy from a good friend of mine, Kyle Wilkinson, who runs one of the best design

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agencies in the UK and beyond. He has done all my branding. He has done, I've worked

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with him for years. He's done an agency with him. He's one of the finest in the business.

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He genuinely is one of the best designers, not only in England, but I believe in the world

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is fantastic at what he does. All right. And he always talks to me about this idea that

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design is everything. Okay. And you walk through a door and guess what? That handle

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somewhere, somehow, not only the concept of a handle working, but that physical handle

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that you've got, the aesthetics of it, they've all been, all that's been designed.

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It's been designed. The hinges have been designed. The door has been designed.

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The mechanism, do we walk in, do we walk out? Do we open inward? Do we open outward?

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Does it slide? Is it a bifold? All of that has been designed for different use cases

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so that we don't notice it. just a door, but it works. And it goes the same for podcasting,

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all right. Bad design stands out, okay. Design in your podcast should be considered

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across the board. Yes, graphic design is very important, but you might have heard

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the phrase sound design. I design my sound. I design, I've designed my audio. I've

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designed not for this show, but some of the sound effects that we use in other shows.

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I've designed. the experience and if you take that upper level, so go to shows like

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what Wondry does with the business walls and even things like the news agents, the new

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show which is by us here at Global, UK's biggest podcast in the news criteria and

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it's the sound design is very well done. So we cut clips into it, we don't cut clips

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into it. The design has been considered and we don't notice it as listeners. We just

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think, well, of course that's there. Of course that clip is there because they contextualize

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that clip. And then they talk. about that clip and so obviously they were going

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to play the clip. But we, so we don't think about it, but someone has, someone's

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considered that. All right. We also need to think about user experience design.

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Okay. So how do I interact as a new listener with your podcast? Okay. Have you

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got a good trail? That's very obvious. Are you naming your titles? Are you typing

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your title, writing your titles in a good way? There was a fantastic podcast that

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I really love. The golf podcast that I tweeted about this a few months ago. And

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their titles were shocking. Like it said, such and such podcast with such and such

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host, episode such and such. And then the guest and the subject was like at the end

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of the episode title. So on Apple podcasts, on Spotify, in my car and whatever, I had no

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idea what that episode was about. And it was a big podcast. So I tweeted them, I

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said, look, listen, Timmy, here's a screenshot. I'm struggling like heck with this.

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I wanna listen to your back catalog, but I don't know if I'm listening to Butch

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Harmon or Bubba Watson or Nelly Corder. I've got no idea. can please name them like

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this. And guess what they did, their producers went through and they changed all

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the back catalog. That's we're in the back and said, thank you, it's much, much better.

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So that's an experience design, even to do with things like your membership, so

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you know your, we talked about a couple of episodes ago, how to design a paid subscription

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and to sell things through your podcast, whether it's fixed price sponsorships, whether

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it's getting tips like I got from Rich and Drew. or whether it is selling your memberships,

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your bonus content, your exclusive content, your windowed content, whatever that might

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be. That experience has to be designed. And when we designed that system, that platform

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into Captivate, we did a lot of that thinking for you. But how do you word the benefits

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in your membership? How do you deliver those? A great example of this is when we do

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things like with Spark of Rebellion, which is that Star Wars show. When people sign

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up to our membership for whatever it is, a few bucks a month, we send them out with

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sticker, a Sparkle Rebellion sticker. And we could just do that, but instead we write

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a handwritten note saying, thank you. And it's part of the experience which has been

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designed. Okay. So design touches everything in your podcast. Yes, the graphics, yes, your

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website, but it's also the experience. You need to design the experience that you

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give to people. You need to design the experience. that goes alongside your membership

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options and your tipping options. You need to design the experience for your guests.

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What does that look like? Do you send production notes like we do? I always send

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production notes out. I plan them episodes using Captivate and I send production notes

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by just exporting the PDF from Captivate which is what it's intended to do. Do you do

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that? Is that guest experience well designed? Will they remember that? Will it

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stick out? Will they understand that is a good experience? Because they probably

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won't. But they'll definitely know if they have a bad experience. If the guest turns

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up and they say, well, what are we talking about? I don't know, what do you think? We

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got any talking points? Well, that's sort of your job as the host. Oh, sorry, I

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forgot to tell you, I've got to finish after 15 minutes because I've got such and

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such. No, no, no. Set all the expectations up front, design that experience, all right?

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So that is super important. Design everything. within your podcast from your graphics to your

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sound design to your guest experience to your user experience, your listener experience,

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everything. The way that you write your show notes has to be well designed. Everything,

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design touches everything. What can you do today? Can you do anything with this?

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Can you implement better design without spending any money? Well, yes, you can. Now,

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like I said, we don't want to commoditize design. Just think this through before you

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sort of run off and do anything. I want you to just stop now and think about what I'm

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about to say. Just because we can get things done cheaply doesn't mean that it's

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commoditized. So the graphic design, like I said at the beginning, just because

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you use Canva doesn't mean that design is cheap. That's just a tool that gives you

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templates from designers who are highly talented and who have been paid a lot of money

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to do those designs. The money still changed hands, it wasn't you that was doing

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the paying. But remember cheap does not equal commoditized. Commoditized does not

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equal cheap. And when I say commoditized, what I mean is people take it for granted.

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So what I don't want you to think when I say this next thing is that... It's easy

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or you should take it for granted. All I'm about to say is that you don't have to

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spend a pile of money doing it. All right, so let's forget graphic design. Let's

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think about other things. Guest design, the experience. Do you have to spend any money

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on that? No. But you've got to spend time thinking about it. OK, just sit down,

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grab a cup of tea, write down a process, a flow, design the experience for your guests.

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What is the pre-booking experience? What is The post-booking experience, what's

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the interview experience, what's the post-interview experience, all right? Design

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that out and then you've got it as a standard operating procedure. What is your

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episode design process? How do you do that? What's your intro, what's your outro?

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What is the middle bit? What is your flow per episode? Because it's not good enough

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to wing it anymore. There's too many podcasts now for you to wing it. Other people

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will do your thing better if you don't do it well, okay? So... All of this just takes

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thinking time, it just takes a mindset, it just takes prioritizing focus. It doesn't

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take money, but that's not to say that it should be taken for granted, all right?

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Just because you don't pay for something doesn't mean that it is not valuable, all right?

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That's the misnomer of free when people give... That's why we don't have a freemium

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product at Captivate, because people take free for granted. They do. They've got

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no skin in the game, so why would they care? They're not going to bother. It's not

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a business model that is for us. So think that through, all right? How can you

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design every part of your podcast from all of the experience to the visuals, to the

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audio? Where do you need to put a bit of money? Well, maybe you need to put a bit

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of money into graphic design or to graphic design software like Canva. Do you need to

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spend money on your episode design or your sound design flow? Probably not really.

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To your guest experience design, no. But I want you to think through the fact that

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design touches everything. because not enough people think like that. And if you can

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do that, you'll stand out. The biggest shows, if you go and look at the top charts,

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they're well-designed in every single aspect. They're calls to action, but well-designed.

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Their graphics are well-designed. Their listener flow, so the format of the episode

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and the way that they guide people through the episode is well-designed. The news agents,

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go and listen to it. It's a great example. Business wars. great example, all right? You

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can stand out from your crowd, all right? We talk about niching down and focusing on

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just your core audience, but the sad fact is there are enough podcasts now where

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it doesn't matter really what competition, sorry, what niche you're in. You will have

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competition. It doesn't matter what niche you are in. There are enough podcasts

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in the world that you will have competition now. You can stand out by designing every facet

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of your podcast. So take some time to do it. It matters, it will help, and it will

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set you up for success because once you've done it, you really don't that often

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need to redo it. So spend a bit of time up front doing it today. It will help you to

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stand out. But let me know how you get along at Mr. Asquith on Twitter or X, whatever

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we're calling it these days. Let me know how you get along. And as I say, if you

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love the show, if it helps you, feel free, a little bit of beer. over at mark.live

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slash support. And until the next time, much love, keep doing what you do and just

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keep publishing, keep providing for your audience because they enjoy it and they

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need it, all right? So until the next time, take it easy. Adios for now.